Friday, February 8, 2008

Charles Lee "Cookie" Thornton

UPDATE, February 8, 2008: "Two Pictures Of Charles Cookie Thornton Emerge"

As we learn more about Charles "Cookie" Thornton, a picture of two completely different people emerges about the man police say killed five people at Kirkwood City Hall Thursday night.

Friends and family going back to the class of 74 describe Thornton as wonderful and outgoing.

Yet, records show, he's been dragged from council meetings in handcuffs, issued thousands of dollars in citations and had more than 100 misdemeanor convictions from the city of Kirkwood.
________________

UPDATE, February 8, 2008: Shooter’s brother: "He mapped out his strategy for war and executed it."
Standing across the street from the site of the killings, Gerald Thornton told reporters that his brother, Charles “Cookie” Thornton, had become “a country of himself” and was forced to “go to war” after the judicial system denied his claims of mistreatment.

“He didn’t go out shooting random people,” Gerald Thornton said. “He mapped out his strategy for war and executed it.”

Another brother, Arthur Thornton, told The Associated Press that his brother left a suicide note on his bed warning “The truth will come out in the end,” before he went on the deadly shooting spree.

Arthur Thornton, 42, said in an interview at the family’s home that he knew his brother was responsible for the killings when he read the one-line note.

“It looks like my brother is going crazy, but he’s just trying to get people’s attention,” Thornton said, explaining he believed the note reflected his brother’s growing frustration with local leaders.

Gerald Thornton said his brother’s problems with the city stemmed from disagreements over building permits. Charles Thornton owned a construction company, Cook Co., that was frequently cited for performing work without the proper permits.

Charles Thornton was cited for more than 126 violations totaling around $64,000, Gerald Thornton said.

The city’s arguments were wrong, his brother said, but when Thornton challenged them in court, his arguments were overruled. It was those failures to find justice in the courts that led him to act last night.

“I understand why he did it,” he said. “He declared war because of the actions done by the court.”

...“Those people he went after were the people listed in his problems with the city,” Thornton said. “Once he was abused by the people in that hall over there he stood up and tried to rectify it.”

...When asked if he felt for his brother’s victims, Thornton said: “No one wants to see loss of life over issues that should’ve been solved. We have educated people over there and they should’ve been able to see the things they were doing should’ve came to an end sooner.”

Thornton also raised the issue of race, suggesting that African Americans have a more difficult time exerting their rights and that his brother’s race was a factor in his difficulties with the city and in the courts.

This is absolutely sick. It is mind-boggling that Gerald Thornton is championing his brother Cookie's actions, rather than expressing sorrow and condemnation.
_______________


Charles Lee "Cookie" Thornton didn't believe in the rule of law.

He took his selfish, "above the law" behavior to deadly heights.

KIRKWOOD, Mo. -- Ten days after losing a federal lawsuit against this St. Louis suburb he insisted harassed him, a gunman stormed a council meeting and opened fire, killing two police officers and three city officials.

The gunman, identified as Charles Lee "Cookie" Thornton, critically injured the city's mayor and wounded a reporter Thursday night before law enforcers fatally shot him.

"The only way that I can put into context that you might understand is that my brother went to war tonight with the people, the government that was putting torment and strife into his life," Thornton's brother, Gerald Thornton, told St. Louis' KMOV-TV.

Oh really?

Thornton decided to go to war because the "government," the mayor, police officers, and city officials were tormenting him.

So to deal with all that "strife," he killed five people.


And he ended up dead. That's usually the way these things turn out.

How was the reporter that Charles Thornton shot part of the torturing government?

I don't know how Gerald Thornton can even attempt to supply a rationale for the shootings carried out by his brother.

Tracy Panus, a St. Louis County Police spokeswoman, said the names of the victims would not be released until a news conference Friday morning. But the wounded included Mayor Mike Swoboda, who was in critical condition late Thursday in the intensive-care unit of St. John's Mercy Hospital in Creve Coeur, hospital spokesman Bill McShane said. Another victim, Suburban Journals newspaper reporter Todd Smith, was in satisfactory condition, McShane said.

Panus said the gunman killed one officer outside City Hall, then walked into the council chambers, shot another and continued pulling the trigger. A witness said the gunman yelled "Shoot the mayor!" as he fired shots in the chambers, hitting Swoboda.

Janet McNichols, a reporter covering the meeting for the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, told the newspaper the meeting had just started when the shooter rushed in and opened fire with at least one weapon. He started yelling about shooting the mayor while walking around and firing, hitting police Officer Tom Ballman in the head, she said.

The shooter then went after Public Works Director Kenneth Yost, who was sitting in front of Swoboda, and shot Yost in the head, McNichols said.

She also said the shooter fired at City Attorney John Hessel, who tried to fight off the attacker by throwing chairs. The shooter then moved behind the desk where the council sits and fired more shots at council members.

What a terrifying scene!

Thornton was on a mission to assassinate the mayor and anyone else who happened to be nearby.
Thornton was often a contentious presence at council meetings; he had twice been convicted of disorderly conduct for disrupting meetings in May 2006.

Most of his ire was directed at the mayor and Yost, McNichols said.

Thornton was well-known at City Hall, often making outrageous comments at public meetings, according to the weekly Webster-Kirkwood Times.

The newspaper quoted Swoboda as saying in June 2006 that Thornton's contentious remarks over the years created "one of the most embarrassing situations that I have experienced in my many years of public service."

Swoboda's comments came during a council meeting attended by Thornton two weeks after the man was forcibly removed from the chambers. The mayor said at the time that the council considered banning Thornton from future meetings but decided against it.

Thornton said during the meeting he had been issued more than 150 tickets.

When allowed to speak during one meeting, he approached the podium with a posterboard with a picture of a donkey and began making harassing remarks about Swoboda.

In a federal lawsuit stemming from his arrests during two meetings just weeks apart, Thornton, representing himself, insisted that Kirkwood officials violated his constitutional rights to free speech by barring him from speaking at the meetings.

But a judge in St. Louis tossed out the suit Jan. 28, writing that "any restrictions on Thornton's speech were reasonable, viewpoint neutral, and served important governmental interests."

Thornton was clearly disruptive and unreasonable.
Gerald Thornton told KMOV the legal setback may have been his brother's final straw. "He has (spoken) on it as best he could in the courts, and they denied all rights to the access of protection and he took it upon himself to go to war and end the issue," he said.

Thornton wasn't a victim.

Gerald Thornton seems to want to elevate him to martyr status, a free speech warrior. That's shameful.


His brother was disorderly. He infringed on the rights of others. Free speech must be exercised responsibly, something Charles Thornton did not do.

Thornton abused his rights. He wasn't stripped of them unfairly
.

This war waged by Charles Thornton was in no way justified. There is no way to rationalize what he did. He was a cold-blooded killer.

44 comments:

Unknown said...

"Whether we bring our enemies to justice, or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done."

Charles Lee 'Cookie' Thornton

Mary said...

Are you suggesting that what Thornton did is on the same plane as the U.S. response to 9/11?

I hope not.

Anonymous said...

If your local government decided to run you out of business by issuing your trucks traffic tickets what would you do?

The same thing was done here. A man wanted to open a bar and he had to close his business because the city kept hitting him with violations of the noise ordinance. His property was zoned correctly!

Mary said...

What would I do? I wouldn't storm into a city council meeting and murder anyone in my way.

My God, there's no justification for what Thornton did.

Absolutely none.

If he believed he was being abused by the government, he should have sought professional legal counsel.

I'm sure there would have been many attorneys who would have been willing to defend Thornton, and expose the abuse to a national audience.

Being interviewed on cable news would have been a better way to get his point across. Don't you think so?

O B J E C T said...

The loss of life is horrible and inexcusable. However, if you want to play one sided law and order and squash a citizens constitutional rights then you are playing with fire. Do you think the British thought it was fair when we revolted against them and started killing to gain our countries independence. Why did we feel the need to kill? Why didn't we just hire a lawyer as someone else suggested and gain independence peacefully? I'm not trying to justify what charles thorton did, only want to point out our countries DNA.

Mary said...

You have got to be kidding!

You cannot compare Thornton's slaughter with the American Revolution.

Look, I don't know the details of Thornton's case.

His dissatisfaction with the government is irrelevant.

Morally, Thornton was wrong to go into a meeting of the City Council and kill officials. He was wrong to kill police officers.

No excuses. None. It's impossible to offer any explanation that will make mass murderer Thornton a sympathetic figure.

Anonymous said...

Of course you can compare the two events. The american revolution was all about a government treating us unfairly. Now I don't think that he should have started murdering people, but to not look at both sides of the story is just wrong. And if it was as simple as just hiring a lawyer to fight his battles....that was just a stupid comment. How was he supposed to afford a lawyer with all the fines he incurred in his fight against the city of Kirkwood. This area has a very large race relations problem and Cookie would not be the first or last black man abused by the system in Missouri.

Mary said...

The ACLU has an affiliate in every state and Puerto Rico. Affiliates handle requests for legal assistance, lobby the state legislatures and host public forums throughout the year. Find your local affiliate in the center column below.

Thornton could have found a lawyer here.

The following contact information is for the Eastern Missouri affiliate of the American Civil Liberties Union. While you can contact the affiliate directly, you can also read about some of work that the affiliate is engaged in by clicking on one of the links on the left and right of this page.

ACLU of Eastern Missouri
Executive Director: Brenda Jones
454 Whittier Avenue
St. Louis, MO 63108
Phone: 314-652-3111

ACLU of Kansas and Western Missouri
Executive Director: Dan Winter
3601 Main St.
Kansas City, MO 64111
Phone: 816-756-3113
Email: staff@aclukswmo.org

Anonymous said...

djnsayne

I agree it is highly abusive for a government or municipality to enforce and apply its laws to all citizens especially when the citizens are minorities. I'm sure none of the other non-minority owned contractors in the area ever received parking tickets or citations for operating without permits

Anonymous said...

Thornton wasn't some downtrodden innocent. He continually broke zoning laws, parking laws, and laws against illegal dumping, and then expected to be treated differently from the general populace.

If anything, Thornton was treated better than the average joe - Kirkwood offered to wipe his slate clean - over 50,000 in fines - if he would just obey the law in the future. That wasn't enough; Thornton wanted an extra 15 million for his mental anguish. Well, gee, don't we all?

Meacham Park and Kirkwood certainly have their share of race-related problems, but don't sit there and cry racism, because that wasn't the case in this instance.

If by anyone other than himself, Thornton was failed by his family. Thornton's family knew he was losing it, yet they did nothing to help him, or to help prevent an imminent tragedy.

Unknown said...

I am not suggesting that what Mr. Thornton did was on the same plane as George Bush's response to 9/11, but I am suggesting that the philosophy is the same - Would you not agree?

Mr. Thornton believed that he was dealing with injustice, and was being tormented by enemies. When he could not get justice from them through the courts, he took justice to them, much like George W. Bush did to Iraq. Bush felt that he couldn't get the type of justice he sought from the UN, so he attacked Iraq. Whats the difference?

Anonymous said...

Cookie Thornton appears to be yet another black man and professional minority businessman who endured a pattern of opposition all of the time against an entrenched racist white upperclass which, while not as overtly obvious as it was in the South of the 1950's and 60's, is nonetheless still in place in 2007 in business suit wearing glad-handing politicians thruout the Southeastern USA. I do not condone his actions but I understand his apparent frustration as I have seen it firsthand also. He should have sought out the help and counsel of the SPLC and the NAACP who would have greatly helped him. Hopefully an Obama/Clinton Administration will expose and reverse some of this recurring pattern of racism and anti-semitism in the USA in the near future!

Anonymous said...

Do you hear me now?

Charles Lee Thornton

Anonymous said...

What I am saying is Charles Lee Thornton is asking "do we hear him now?" Because it is obvious he was invisable before. Why did it take this for his humanity to be acknowledge? Victim is not a dirty word, it is the truth of the history of black people in Americah. If Jews can say they were victims, so were we and time is on our side for justice to come. The only ones in this country that feels a sense of entitlement is white people, the world is theres according to thier warp way of thinking but God not man is in control and you will reap what you sow. No one cared about Emmitt Till, or Sean Bell and others murdered black men and boys so why should I care about these victims. Are their lives more valuble? I think not.

Mary said...

Thomas said: Hopefully an Obama/Clinton Administration will expose and reverse some of this recurring pattern of racism and anti-semitism in the USA in the near future!


Did the eight years of Bill Clinton's administration help?

Mary said...

Bottom line:

Thornton ended five lives. Add to that the life-altering grief and sorrow of the family and friends of those individuals.

What he did was wrong under the law of man and the law of God.

Some of the commenters here are crying racism while dealing in racism themselves.

If Thornton was treated unfairly due to his race, that's illegal. He should and COULD have found legal recourse.

Murdering five people was not the answer to his complaints. He killed people who had nothing to do with his issues with the government.

My prayers are with the victims' families and friends.

Unknown said...

I said nothing about racism. I pointed out the similarities of his actions and George Bush. How many innocents have died at the whim of George W? However, just because you keep repeating that he should have sued means nothing. Under the Bush administration, discrimination lawsuits have been just about eliminated in the courts. He has stacked the EEOC to the point that it is nearly impossible to bring a case to the federal courts. Not to mention the fact that in the years it would have taken to get the suit through the courts in the unlikely event that he did make it, he would have been out of business and destitute. Now, I surely do not condone Mr. Thornton's actions, but I think you should stop pointing to the courts as the answer to the problem, because it definitely was not. As a matter of fact, it is part of the problem under the current administration.

Also, you are wrong that the people he killed had nothing to do with hos issues with the government, because they were the government who he perceived was persecuting him.

And yes, things were better under Bill Clinton.

Anonymous said...

Do you people even know why Cookie received those 150 plus tickets?

He wasn't being harassed. He thought he was above the law. He thought he could make his own rules. Is it ok to park your trucks in your front yard even if there are laws against it? If you receive a ticket for violating that ordinance is it harassment if you continue to receive tickets for that same violation over and over?

If you dump stuff illegally shouldn't you be ticketed for that?

If you decide to use the Sam's club parking lot as your own personal parking lot should you not be ticketed for it?

After so many violations you come under more scrutiny from police because you are a know habitual offender is that harassment?

Cookie wasn't persecuted by the Kirkwood government. He thought he was above the law. He thought he could make his own rules. Plain and simple he was disturbed. He needed help.

Killing people was not the answer. Life is precious. Don't people realize that?

Unknown said...

I realize that life is precious and all life should be protected, I just think Mr. Bush believes some life is more valuable than others. I read in several articles that Mr. Thornton's home had a very neat appearance and that he did not park his trucks in his yard, but in his driveway. Also, if they gave Mr. Thornton 150 tickets for these violations, were they giving anyone else the same type of tickets for the same violations? I'm sorry, but yes, $64,000.00 in tickets seems to be excessive to me.

Anonymous said...

If you had more intimate knowledge of the situation and things that took place you wouldn't think they were excessive. He most certainly did park his trucks in his front yard. Heck his driveway was not large enough for all of those vehicles.

Sure, other people received citations. Not to the excess that Cookie did because most right thinking kind of people start obeying the law when they receive a citation. Not Cookie. He thought he could run his business any way he saw fit. There are rules and regulations and he didn't think he had to abide by them. He also thought he could just show up at council meetings and speak whenever he chose to. Once again he thought he would make his own rules and regulations.

He had a complete disregard for the rules and regulations of the city. When it finally became apparent to him that he couldn't park his vehicles in his yard he decided to make Sam's club his personal parking lot for his fleet of vehicles. Who in their right mind thinks they can do that and get away with it.

To top all that off he was caught on numerous occasions dumping illegally. Dumping materials from his jobs into dumpsters of other businesses. Again, most normal thinking individuals would stop that kind of activity when they received a citation. Why didn't Cookie? Because he thought he was above the law.

The number of citations were not excessive. Well, I take that back. They were excessive because Cookie made it that way. Over and over and over again he committed the same violations. So, yes they were excessive because he continued to do the same things over and over.

If you commit the same crime continually, you should be cited for it. The only thing Kirkwood did wrong was letting him continue to do these things on a habitual basis and not lock him up.

Anonymous said...

First, I wonder if anyone has thought to do an autopsy on Thornton to see if he had some sort of a medical condition that would drive him to this extreme. If they were to find that he had a brain tumor, that could offer some explanation.

Let's not sugar coat this in any way, this man was a mass murderer, pure and simple. Nothing else about the situation matters. He killed five defenseless people in cold blood.

Not only was he a mass murderer but a COWARD to an extreme degree.

He shot his first victim IN THE BACK. He rushed his second victim, hiding his guns behind a sign that he was carrying, and then shot him in the head with a large caliber pistol at close range. Again, what a COWARD this person was.

The city bent over backwards for him. How many of us coud rack up this many tickets, not pay them but not be thrown in jail? He was handled with kid gloves by the city.

Don't be fooled by the implcation that this was an issue of race. All of us have to follow the rules and this person could not abide by them, even at the end.

Unknown said...

I don't think anyone condones or excuses what Mr. Thornton did. Violence should never be the answer to ones problems. THAT SAID, I still submit that there is little difference between Mr. Thornton's actions and Mr. Bush's actions. And I think if you vilify Mr. Thornton, then you have to be equally harsh on Mr. Bush for his actions, which have caused the death and displacement of millions, for reasons very similar to Mr. Thornton's.

Mary said...

It is absolutely ridiculous to compare going to war against al Qaeda or Saddam Hussein's Iraq with what Thornton did.

Good grief.

Anonymous said...

"The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed, from time to time, with the blood of both Patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure." - Thomas Jeferson

Just because you wouldn't chose to value liberty more than your own life doesn't mean that others shouldn't. Without men willing and able to take such stances the Revolutionary War never would have been fought.

We established this country to protect the rights of it's citizens from all aggresors. That includes our own government.

The government does not get a pass on rights violations. Infact, since it's only just function is the protection of our rights, we must be much quicker and harsher of it in our judgements.

Men who willfully violate the rights of others (such as this council) forfiet all protection of their own rights, as one cannot logically claim protection of their own rights when they act as the aggressor in harming another.

Unknown said...

I never mentioned al-Queada. And of course everyone should know by now that there was no Queada in Iraq The UN refused to endorse Bush's invasion, so he got mad and decided to handle things with violence. So what is the difference? Please explain.

Anonymous said...

It is so easy for us to sit on our high horses and cast judgment on Cookie Thornton. But if any of us even get the slightest idea that our freedoms and rights are being trampled upon, some of us would be hard pressed not to want to employ drastic measures to let orselves be heard.
The fact is, no one wants to address issues such as government abuses of power and race until something bad happens.
What's done is done and we can debate the rightness and wrongness of the situation and it won't change anything. We'll bury the dead, lay flowers at the sight of the massacre,demonize the gunman and go back to our old ways until the next person decides to make a statement with a loaded gun.
Is there anybody here that has a solution to prevent the next tragedy. What's really sickening is all this posturing. Less words, more action.

Mary said...

I have had this blog for years.

In that time, I've had plenty of weird comments on a variety of subjects.

But some of the comments left on this thread are among the most disgusting that I've ever had.

Really unbelievable.

GOOD LORD, THORNTON KILLED FIVE PEOPLE IN COLD BLOOD!

THERE'S NO EXCUSE FOR WHAT HE DID.

NONE.

FIVE PEOPLE ARE DEAD AND YOU'RE ACTING AS APOLOGISTS FOR THAT KILLER.

IT'S TWISTED. IT'S SICK. IT'S INEXCUSABLE.

That's all I have to say about the murders.

Prayers for the grieving family and friends of Thornton's victims.

Anonymous said...

Mary:

I'm sorry, but love is not something that we all deserve. We have to earn the privlidge of being loved. Being loved is not a right.

All lives do not carry the same value. Not all lives are precious. While we all come into this world with the innate natural right to life, each of equal value under just law, we can forfiet that right through our own willful acts and decisions.

The dead amongst the government officials willfully violated the individual soveriegnty of Mr. Thornton, yet wielding a power they felt was unreproachable (the oft swung trencheon of government authority) the felt no compulsion to cease the gross violation they were commiting. The governments complicitness in this matter is only reinforced by the involvment, and decision of a federal court who ruled against Mr. Thornton's right to freedom of speech. A right that is not only natural, but garenteed to be protected by our government in our own guiding document, and high law of the land. The US Constitution.

The men he killed were in violation of his rights, and they themselves by their own actions justly forfiet their lives to the man who's rights they infringed upon.

Perhaps, rather than mourning five dead tyrants; we should moun the state of our society.

A society that more closely resembles Mussolini's Italy that Madison's America.

But then again, don't mind me. I've just been paying attention.

Anonymous said...

Local government (white people)
decided Cookie Thornton (black) was
an undesirable person. They went
about harassing him with tickets.

Local lawyers do not take cases against town governments they practice in.

Cookie Thornton (a great American)
took matters in his own hands.

Anonymous said...

Jews were victims, black people were victims, now victims oppress each other. Why not put it like "black antisemite kills the rasist jew"?

Anonymous said...

This is not a black rights issue. It is a natural rights issue.

Any time you argue on the grounds of race, and group think, you weaken your position.

You are not a memeber of a group. You are an individual. Groups don't have rights. Individuals have rights.

Government policy does not oppress races, it oppreses individual members of economic classes.

The more you buy into the racial injustice garbage, and seek solice in the protection of your "group" the do more harm to the group you are asociating with then the people you claim are persecuting you.

Unknown said...

Rynar,


Hear Hear! and amen. It has nothing to do with race, but as Mr. Bush says - "Justice". The question is, who is defining what justice is.

Anonymous said...

Most of these comments about Cookie being justified are the sickest most irresponsible thing I have ever heard.
Did you know that Cookie went bankrupt and cheated creditors out of over $400,000. He filed court papers incorrectly and when told how to do it right never did. Four different courts can't be wrong regardless of race. Did you know that The City of Kirkwood held a special court session exclusivly for Cookie so he could plead his case? Cookie Thorntons problem was his unwillingness to play by the rules that everbody else plays by. The notion that because he was black, and everybody was out to get him is self imposed justification for him not to take responsibility for himself and his actions. If his justification was truly racism or racial bias and he was being oppresses by the white plantation mentallity he would have never been allowed into City Hall to start with, much less be able to call a white man a jackass and live to see the next day. This is an example of racism. Race is an excuse for not living up to your responsibilities as a citizen. He thought he was above the law and innocent people payed with their lives because he was too damn stubborn to admit he was wrong.

Victor Valentine said...

Who says ya can't fight city hall?

Is anyone else wondering why a political assassination has been virtually ignored by the media in this country?

I'm sure the man had a legitimate aurgument with the government. The fault I find with him is allowing it to break him.

He did exactly what the system wanted him to do.

RIP Cookie.

Anonymous said...

Today I drove through downtown Kwood. It really is a charming place to live, and Meachem Park's history--or their current anger was never something I knew about. My son goes to the middle school w/ many Meachem kids. My son comes home wanting to be black because his friends are so cool.

I had no issue with that until Cookie did what he did.

Now, sadly my thoughts all week feel much more "racist" than they did last week. I just see a huge difference between "them" and "us" now.

case in point, HUGE memorial at City Hall; dozens of flowers, bears, balloons, signs....

In the back parking lot of the local orthodontist where Cookie's terror was ended by a lawful bullet, sand covers his blood where it soaked the pavement, someone put a blanket over it and one flower bouquet. That's a hero's death? That's a hero's memorial?

That's how selfish stupid people die.

He may have been a great uncle, friend, son and man in life, for his whole life, but he went out with a big huge fuck up and basically will burn in hell now depsite how many bake sales, cub scouts, etc he presided over. If you are GOOD, be good to the end.

I think the big difference between us is that we recognize wrong when we see it and don't glamorize it. We didn't say John Wilkes Booth had a point, we don't say Jeffery Dallmer felt he had no other choice, we don't say that David Hinkley wasn't getting enough attention at cabinet meetings adn never in a million years would we condone what the asassin who liked Dr. King did. Race isn't the issue, the man is. We call the man and his acts what they are; murderous criminals.

For whatever reason, Meachem Park residents are calling this man a hero.

There is the racial divide.

Now, we are going to have people with that mentality voting in the election for likely the first time and safe to say who will get their vote, regardless of the man, but because of his color.

We are not anywhere close to solving racism.

On tv this week, the NAACP Image awards! Blacks can win Grammys, Oscars, Emmys, but could I win a NAACP Image Award? NO because I am NOT black! BUT if "we" held a Whitey Image Award, get out!! We would be shut down in 30 seconds. Racism!!

YOU people play the race card.

Don't go back to Africa, we want you here, but with us, not against us.

Anonymous said...

We were oppressed as a group because of our skin color not as individuals and slavery was not in bibical times, slaves were still alive in the 1920 and 30s, so we should just get over it. Jeffrey Damar eating black men had sick is in no comparision nothing to what Cookie did, died for what he beleived in, Justice by any means neccessary. Did you know China has given America a human rights violation reports now for a few years citing racism aganist blacks as a human rights violation that needs to be fixed before America give out reports to other country. Do you care that America has the largest prison population in the world per capital for mostly non-voilent offenders serving 20 to life so small white towns can build prisons to give jobs to their residents and count the prisoners in their census. We don't want you all to go back to Europe either but we do want justice and God is on the side of right. Can't we all get along, NO! we obiviously can not but you have no speacial claim to this land, our blood, sweat and tears are mixed in this soil as well so we are not going anywhere. We were here before the Mayflower.

Anonymous said...

In order to "fix" a problem, it is important to find the real cause of the problem. I did not know Cookie, but everyone seems to think he had many wonderful qualities and that he did a great number of good things in the Meacham Park community. Like everyone else, I am trying to understand the goodness in the man and the terrible, unjustified and senseless cold blooded act of murder.
It seems to me that many people unfamiliar with the specifics of the situation are voicing oppinions based on their personal perspective of the way their world works--it must be Big Government's fault, or whitey's fault or the n...s fault. I have heard that the parking tickets were hundreds of thousands of dollars, and that they totaled less than $20,000. I have also heard so many other opinions voiced as facts. With so much misinformation out there, I really am trying to figure out what is real and what is assumed.

I understand that Cookie felt that he was persecuted, but that does NOT mean that he was. Every parent knows that to be true.

I have gone on St. Louis County's Revenue site and searched for real estate and personal property tax histories for Charles Thornton and for Maureen and Charles Thorton h/w The records show that Cookie has not kept his tax bills paid on his real estate properties or his vehicles/personal property. One of his properties has been tagged by the County to be sold for unpaid taxes. I also know that he filed for bankruptcy in 1999 and some of his debts were unpaid child support, and Federal and State taxes. In addition, his wife's home in Florida was recently foreclosed on.

Such things lead me to believe that perhaps Cookie felt that laws that apply to each of us did not apply to him. This is not racial discrimination, this is failure to be mature and shoulder your responsibilities. Even when the Federal court declared that he had not had his rights trampled, he still clung to his own opinion that they had been and that it was personal, and racial. You've heard the saying "Sometimes we feel that when we ask God for something, He doesn't listen, but He did listen, however, His answer was NO"
Just because the legal system did not give Cookie the answer he wanted, doesn't mean that it was unfair or racist. Perhaps it was that under the law, he wasn't entitled to what he thought he was.

I think another part to consider is that Cookie thought his lawsuit would bring him several million dollars, and that would have solved a lot of the financial problems that were stressing him. I am NOT saying that he didn't believe he deserved the money, just that having perhaps counted on getting it, he was hugely disappointed (who wouldn't be).

I do not know why Cookie chose to do this heinous act, even those who knew him well were shocked.
Maybe is wasn't the world being against him. Maybe it was feeling that he deserved more, or would be more financially solvent by his 50's (a "midlife crisis" type of feeling).

What makes me sad about Cookie is that he was like the lead in a Greek Tradgedy--the hero always has a fatal flaw. It seems that Cookie was a wonderful man in many ways and was an asset to his community. Unfortunately, he saw himself as personally persecuted and could see no other perspective.

At the end of a week of so much sadness, I am also sorry that, because of a flawed perspective on personal responsibility, we have lost all the future positive experiences of having all six of the persons with us and that Mayor Swoboda's life has been permanently altered.

An election had been scheduled for April 9th to elect a new mayor (Mayor Swoboda could not have sought another term) The lead candidate was Connie Karr, a white woman who served on the Meacham Park committee and placed a priority on improving relations between Meacham Park and the rest of Kirkwood. If he had waited 2 months, Mayor Swoboda would have been out of office and COnnie Karr would perhaps have been the new mayor. Very sad.

Anonymous said...

Your argument is rife with logical fallacies.

Laws do not make something wrong or right, justness does. We do not have to follow unjust laws, and the government does not get to determine what is just and what is not.

Just because the government says that there are laws that must be equally applied to everyone, and the government forces taxation at the point of a gun, that does not make them just in doing so.

Taxation is nothing more than theft, and agents of the government driving that taxation are nothing more than thugs who would rob you at the ATM machine.

Property tax is nothing more than rent. If the government can sieze your property for not paying taxes, then the government owns your home, and not you.

Theives deserve no quarter.

I have no compassion for the dead,or the mayor, as they were nothing more than thieves.

Anonymous said...

A little late here, everyone stopped posting in February. But reading the comments, no one stops to think about the morality of the laws themselves. Why should the government be able to issue me a citation because I park my truck in my driveway? Its MY DRIVEWAY! "Government" is obviously not the correct venue to handle this. If people complain, they should take it to the homeowners board. And if their isn't one, just grow up, quit being a busy body, and worry more about yourself.

Anonymous said...

Time sure leaves things go doesn't it.
Wonder why the news reporter that had the four tapes on the Charles Thorton Interview was never printed or reported.
Was it because the lawyer for the city of Kirwood's FIRM also was a firm that the Papers and Media of St. Louis used? Maybe? The four interview sessions were of interest to me, he would take out a permit and the city would be waiting on the site to harass him? Other contractors would take permits and let Charles Thornton do the work, so the city would leave him alone. How quickly we all return to our normal lifes and brush this below and say, he was crazy. Yes a crazy act, but something was atypical here, this was a college grad, track star, with a business degree that sat on many of Kirkwoods Boards for years? Wish a reporter would dig and do some diligence, time has healed some.
There was a great interview that explained what was being done to him, no excuse to do what he did, but it never came out as he thought it would "the truth will come out in the end".

Anonymous said...

a little late, now is time to investigate why the interviews done by a reporter was never published in one ST. Louis paper. Yes, I have heard them, the harassment he explains seems very real.
Now that a year has passed an only on the actual day does the news stations do a little clip is when someone can look into the treatment that drove someone to a terrible act. Yes absolutely wrong and terrible, but his words were never printed., just a link for a week or two at one T.V. stations website.
Interesting tapes.

Anonymous said...

Sheesh some people just dont get it. The people in this country are getting taken advantage of daily by big business and government. Its funny how people strtuggling to make it understand "Cookie" yet those that are well to do are shocked by his actions. Wake up people. The fine people of this country are fed up with corruption. The whole idea of that is how this country began and ther are some that will take the ultimate step to try and take the country back. Woule the person making the comments about what his brother said please read the "Patriot Act" and then come back with some more B.S.? Im not naive and neither are many others. I have a decal i made that says "Its going to take alot Cookies before we can have our cake." Try to take something away from someone that they worked really hard for and that provides for them and see how they react. Violence is never good but sometimes needed and corruption is never ok. What your article doesnt contain is how someone on the baord had ties with the same type of business. Ya wonder if that had an effect on the lack of rights Cookie had? I do.

WakeUpIsrael said...

"Whether we bring our enemies to justice, or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done."

You expect a man to try to talk his way out of oppression, when we been talking for years? Now thats irrelevant! In no way or form does charles "cookie" or I feel regret for what happen. Wake UP !!!!

WakeUpIsrael said...

ps . One black man with a lawyer will not obtain justice. So why talk? why do a interview with kmov? Why dedicate your life to find justice where it doesnt exist? Thats why its WAR